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posted:
12/4/2009 8:08:12 PM
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Mayhem
rank: 1686
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As you may have herd , Obama has decided to bring his troops back from the Middle East in July 2011. But he has also decided to put more troops in by Christmas 2009, and the rest that are ready and trained to go in Summer 2010!
I think myself that it was a so- so idea to put a set date on bringing the troops back, And putting in so many troops by Christmas is a bit much. I also think that if the war isn't over by then, and the troops are pulled out, there might be more attacks like 911 in the states. (And we certainty wouldn't want more tragedy  )
They say Canada will not be effected by this, but maybe Harper will decided to follow in Obama's footsteps.
What do you think of this?
What would you think if Steven Harper decides to do this as well?
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As you may have herd , Obama has decided to bring his troops back from the Middle East in July 2011. But he has also decided to put more troops in by Christmas 2009, and the rest that are ready and trained to go in Summer 2010!
I think myself that it was a so- so idea to put a set date on bringing the troops back, And putting in so many troops by Christmas is a bit much. I also think that if the war isn't over by then, and the troops are pulled out, there might be more attacks like 911 in the states. (And we certainty wouldn't want more tragedy )
They say Canada will not be effected by this, but maybe Harper will decided to follow in Obama's footsteps.
What do you think of this?
What would you think if Steven Harper decides to do this as well?
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posted:
12/6/2009 3:37:04 PM
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Mayhem
rank: 1838
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Well,i dont like the idea of putting more troops in,especially near Christmas....
But at least he's deciding to take the troops out in 2011....
So this is like bad-good news...it's bad that he's making them stay there evn more, but it's good that he has planned to take them out in a certain date......we just have to see if will he come through this "promise"....
And to be honest, i not sure if Harper is going to follow this......
~think calm colours~
-dream12
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Well,i dont like the idea of putting more troops in,especially near Christmas....
But at least he's deciding to take the troops out in 2011....
So this is like bad-good news...it's bad that he's making them stay there evn more, but it's good that he has planned to take them out in a certain date......we just have to see if will he come through this "promise"....
And to be honest, i not sure if Harper is going to follow this......
~think calm colours~
-dream12
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posted:
12/6/2009 5:49:43 PM
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Mayonnaise
rank: 44
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We shouldn't be in there in the first place, some weapons of mass destruction those were.
X~Rock_for_Ever~X
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We shouldn't be in there in the first place, some weapons of mass destruction those were.
X~Rock_for_Ever~X
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posted:
12/6/2009 6:34:35 PM
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Ah-MAY-Zing
rank: 4597
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dream12-what does near christmas have anything to do with it being worse? Now I'm not exactly in suport of him sending more troops there but he has ot a date lined up.
ȣ-ÏŊȘƩƇŦǾ-ĦȺ₭₭Ⱥ-ȣ
ȣ-ƦȺ₱-ĦØÜŊĐ-ȣ
ȣ-ŦĦƩ-₭ƦÏŁŁ-ȣ
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dream12-what does near christmas have anything to do with it being worse? Now I'm not exactly in suport of him sending more troops there but he has ot a date lined up.
ȣ-ÏŊȘƩƇŦǾ-ĦȺ₭₭Ⱥ-ȣ
ȣ-ƦȺ₱-ĦØÜŊĐ-ȣ
ȣ-ŦĦƩ-₭ƦÏŁŁ-ȣ
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posted:
12/6/2009 7:25:18 PM
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I don't even know if I really trust that he'll follow through on that haha I haven't been following the news but has he actually lived up to all the hype that there was when he got elected? Or is he just a sigh of relief compared to Georgey W?
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I don't even know if I really trust that he'll follow through on that haha I haven't been following the news but has he actually lived up to all the hype that there was when he got elected? Or is he just a sigh of relief compared to Georgey W?
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posted:
12/6/2009 7:45:09 PM
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Ah-MAY-Zing
rank: 2061
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This "war" is all politics, so he has to be extremely careful in what he does. He wants to leave in a way to make America look good. Going in there, terrorizing the citizens, and forcing the Taliban out just to install a new, almost as bad, organization into power don't exactly make America look good. Probably has a plan or something, or planning to get something extremely relevant and worthwhile done, but chance are, the troops won't be leaving at the specified time, things change, not everything is given out. o-o Them governmentz. They can be quite the tricksters. D:
-Boxix
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This "war" is all politics, so he has to be extremely careful in what he does. He wants to leave in a way to make America look good. Going in there, terrorizing the citizens, and forcing the Taliban out just to install a new, almost as bad, organization into power don't exactly make America look good. Probably has a plan or something, or planning to get something extremely relevant and worthwhile done, but chance are, the troops won't be leaving at the specified time, things change, not everything is given out. o-o Them governmentz. They can be quite the tricksters. D:
-Boxix
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posted:
12/6/2009 10:03:19 PM
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Ah-MAY-Zing
rank: 4576
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It is nice that Obama is thinking of pulling troops in 2011 but what we need to realize is that these terrorists are not prepared to stop until they are DEAD thats how commited to destroying the country of America they are, this couldn't be illustrated better than by all the suicide bombings, these people put no value on their own lives which makes them some of the most dangerous kinds of people to deal with. I'm not trying to be pessimistic but it's the truth. The war isn't just going to go "poof" because the terrorists all of a sudden dont have people to fight close to home.
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It is nice that Obama is thinking of pulling troops in 2011 but what we need to realize is that these terrorists are not prepared to stop until they are DEAD thats how commited to destroying the country of America they are, this couldn't be illustrated better than by all the suicide bombings, these people put no value on their own lives which makes them some of the most dangerous kinds of people to deal with. I'm not trying to be pessimistic but it's the truth. The war isn't just going to go "poof" because the terrorists all of a sudden dont have people to fight close to home.
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posted:
12/7/2009 6:00:28 PM
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Mayhem
rank: 1543
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30,000 more troops being deployed into a nation that has had problems from the very beginning. Is the war in Afghanistan even possible to win? Or, are we going to be threatened by bloody terrorists for the rest of our lives?
I think an additional 7000 will aid the battle, but they're from from an other country or are from other countries.
AlyCat53: We don't want another 9/11, but there are sick-minded people on this planet that DO want those disasters. And they're not terrorists.
Initially after 9/11 a group of Palestinian people were seen celebrating the American tragedy. As far as I'm concerned, they should be locked up.
Well, it is good that Obama has a date in which the soldiers will start to pull out, but is it soon enough? Will anything be accomplished?
I don't know why it's taken so long to train and hand over power to the Afghani's so we can go home. American troops are only trained for six weeks.
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30,000 more troops being deployed into a nation that has had problems from the very beginning. Is the war in Afghanistan even possible to win? Or, are we going to be threatened by bloody terrorists for the rest of our lives?
I think an additional 7000 will aid the battle, but they're from from an other country or are from other countries.
AlyCat53: We don't want another 9/11, but there are sick-minded people on this planet that DO want those disasters. And they're not terrorists.
Initially after 9/11 a group of Palestinian people were seen celebrating the American tragedy. As far as I'm concerned, they should be locked up.
Well, it is good that Obama has a date in which the soldiers will start to pull out, but is it soon enough? Will anything be accomplished?
I don't know why it's taken so long to train and hand over power to the Afghani's so we can go home. American troops are only trained for six weeks.
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posted:
12/7/2009 8:26:32 PM
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Ah-MAY-Zing
rank: 2061
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@ghostchild, what do you mean a country that had problems from the very beginning? Afghanistan was a prominent, strong, educated country until the Soviet invasion. They were independent and developing, and now they're one of the poorest countries in the world because they have been ravaged by war for over 30 years. And even after the Soviet's withdrew their troops from Afghanistan, the Americans installed the Taliban into power. Which suppressed their women. And statistics show, if your country does not educate women, your going to be in bad shape.
Basically, Afghanistan wasn't always bad from the beginning, they just had a series of unfortunate events, followed by hostile leaders, and just ended up with the short end of the stick. :|
But, I digress (whatever that means  )
-Boxix
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@ghostchild, what do you mean a country that had problems from the very beginning? Afghanistan was a prominent, strong, educated country until the Soviet invasion. They were independent and developing, and now they're one of the poorest countries in the world because they have been ravaged by war for over 30 years. And even after the Soviet's withdrew their troops from Afghanistan, the Americans installed the Taliban into power. Which suppressed their women. And statistics show, if your country does not educate women, your going to be in bad shape.
Basically, Afghanistan wasn't always bad from the beginning, they just had a series of unfortunate events, followed by hostile leaders, and just ended up with the short end of the stick. :|
But, I digress (whatever that means )
-Boxix
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posted:
12/7/2009 10:09:24 PM
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Mayhem
rank: 1838
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It doesnt make it worse, it's just near christams the soliders should be with their familes and stuff.....
~think calm colours~
-dream12
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It doesnt make it worse, it's just near christams the soliders should be with their familes and stuff.....
~think calm colours~
-dream12
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posted:
12/7/2009 11:07:14 PM
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| QUOTE (child of teh ghostiez) | | Is the war in Afghanistan even possible to win? |
The Soviets tried to do it and failed, and the Americans will also soon fail...a Guerilla War can't be won unless the American side resorts to the same tactics, which I don't ever see happening.
This war is simply about money IMO...the US goes and destroys Afghanistan, and guess who gets payed big $$$ to rebuild the cities? American companies owned by rich buisnessman and politicians. And of course all of the oil in the Middle East, which the US obviously wants to keep its hand in.
Ohmyz.
The lesson is, people can't be trusted with too much power and influence. D:
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| QUOTE (child of teh ghostiez) | | Is the war in Afghanistan even possible to win? |
The Soviets tried to do it and failed, and the Americans will also soon fail...a Guerilla War can't be won unless the American side resorts to the same tactics, which I don't ever see happening.
This war is simply about money IMO...the US goes and destroys Afghanistan, and guess who gets payed big $$$ to rebuild the cities? American companies owned by rich buisnessman and politicians. And of course all of the oil in the Middle East, which the US obviously wants to keep its hand in.
Ohmyz.
The lesson is, people can't be trusted with too much power and influence. D:
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posted:
12/8/2009 1:19:43 AM
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Mayhem
rank: 1946
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First of all Harper should not "follow" Obama. The United States will simply leave our troops there and pat themselves on the backs as heroes even though they've just messed a lot of things up. Canada should continue its fight, don't get me wrong, but it will remain a Canadian one! I'm sick of comedians making jokes about Canada! I don't even want to talk about this subject....
I did watch Obama's speech. I agree that he should put more troops into the conflict (not like Vietnam or Korea) but the timing is off. Obama put a date on pulling the troops to save his own butt... that's election politics. Of course this half-hearted conflict gets old, and if they think it'll end anytime soon they're wrong. I never liked Obama... his dog is more popular than our PM.
Once again the United States follows their red, white, and blue into something they don't plan to finish. Lets hope Canada can clean up the mess, right?
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First of all Harper should not "follow" Obama. The United States will simply leave our troops there and pat themselves on the backs as heroes even though they've just messed a lot of things up. Canada should continue its fight, don't get me wrong, but it will remain a Canadian one! I'm sick of comedians making jokes about Canada! I don't even want to talk about this subject....
I did watch Obama's speech. I agree that he should put more troops into the conflict (not like Vietnam or Korea) but the timing is off. Obama put a date on pulling the troops to save his own butt... that's election politics. Of course this half-hearted conflict gets old, and if they think it'll end anytime soon they're wrong. I never liked Obama... his dog is more popular than our PM.
Once again the United States follows their red, white, and blue into something they don't plan to finish. Lets hope Canada can clean up the mess, right?
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posted:
12/8/2009 4:44:55 AM
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That's the thing about Afganistan, the MiddleEast, and Africa, among otherplaces. The modern civilisations only make things worse with all the military interference. Some of the charity action is helpful, but going in there with guns has yet to produce positive results. Afganistan is a broiken nation and as it stands, no noble government will be able to maintain control without being propped up by America. They went in there and trashed the country. Now it NEEDS them or else it will likely revert to the way it was, or become even worse.
With all due respect, jchansfan
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That's the thing about Afganistan, the MiddleEast, and Africa, among otherplaces. The modern civilisations only make things worse with all the military interference. Some of the charity action is helpful, but going in there with guns has yet to produce positive results. Afganistan is a broiken nation and as it stands, no noble government will be able to maintain control without being propped up by America. They went in there and trashed the country. Now it NEEDS them or else it will likely revert to the way it was, or become even worse.
With all due respect, jchansfan
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posted:
12/8/2009 7:59:06 PM
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Ah-MAY-Zing
rank: 4576
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| QUOTE (Outlaw) | | I never liked Obama... his dog is more popular than our PM. |
D; It's the sad, sad truth...
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| QUOTE (Outlaw) | | I never liked Obama... his dog is more popular than our PM. |
D; It's the sad, sad truth...
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posted:
12/8/2009 8:46:05 PM
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Ah-MAY-Zing
rank: 8282
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The question of whether or not American troops are in the Middle East has little to no relevance on whether there will be more attacks on the US. There are still plenty of independent terrorist groups - Osama Bin Laden anyone? - at large in the country and the US has proved ineffectual in stopping them. What will really stop further attacks on the US are tighter domestic security measures.
And I agree with pulling out the troops after one last effort. The US should show that it learned something from the Vietnam War.
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The question of whether or not American troops are in the Middle East has little to no relevance on whether there will be more attacks on the US. There are still plenty of independent terrorist groups - Osama Bin Laden anyone? - at large in the country and the US has proved ineffectual in stopping them. What will really stop further attacks on the US are tighter domestic security measures.
And I agree with pulling out the troops after one last effort. The US should show that it learned something from the Vietnam War.
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posted:
12/9/2009 1:08:31 AM
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Mayhem
rank: 1946
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Well it isn't our place to say whether positive results are coming from this. Our media tells us only of Canadian deaths! I have heard stories from people who've been over there (on TV and at school) and it actually means a lot to to the people in the war-torn countries that we're coming from our good lives, putting it all at risk, to help them. Maybe we see it as a battle against terror, but know that the brave troops see it as a fight to help those people. I want to join the forces for the very reason of helping those people. It's not like we are coming in making them do a government our way then leaving them (yes Bush, you'd like that)! Many of Them want our government system, and they'd love to vote!
The problem with conflicts like these is the money! They cost a lot! The people don't support the conflict because they only learn of its faults. Then the PM is faced with a huge problem! The people don't want to pay (like the American revolution) for this 'slaughter of Canadian lives' so the PM can't support it either or the next election will be in peril! That's the problem with our politics... a politician can't really think long term. Not to forget the fact that the media is waiting to stab the government in the back on every choice they make! Hurray Canadian Politics!
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Well it isn't our place to say whether positive results are coming from this. Our media tells us only of Canadian deaths! I have heard stories from people who've been over there (on TV and at school) and it actually means a lot to to the people in the war-torn countries that we're coming from our good lives, putting it all at risk, to help them. Maybe we see it as a battle against terror, but know that the brave troops see it as a fight to help those people. I want to join the forces for the very reason of helping those people. It's not like we are coming in making them do a government our way then leaving them (yes Bush, you'd like that)! Many of Them want our government system, and they'd love to vote!
The problem with conflicts like these is the money! They cost a lot! The people don't support the conflict because they only learn of its faults. Then the PM is faced with a huge problem! The people don't want to pay (like the American revolution) for this 'slaughter of Canadian lives' so the PM can't support it either or the next election will be in peril! That's the problem with our politics... a politician can't really think long term. Not to forget the fact that the media is waiting to stab the government in the back on every choice they make! Hurray Canadian Politics!
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posted:
12/9/2009 7:10:10 PM
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Mayhem
rank: 1543
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I have an idea! We bring the Canadian Forces, the United States military, the armies of the Middle Eastern nations involved in this war, and other nations of NATO, and we unleash a full-fledged assault on the terrorists. Bomb them, shoot them, use the arsenal our countries are packing, the resources, and the intelligence to FINISH THIS WAR. Then, all coalition troops pull-out, and the Afghani's look at their country. If they need help in the future, foreign nations should have to help.
No sissy efforts. This is a war they WE ARE ALL involved in. When those terrorists attacked the United States, they just didn't attack America, they attacked all the countries who's citizens were killed/affected in 9/11. They also showed us that terrorisms exists, and that they will not back down easily.
Boxix: Well, I not sure if Afghanistan has always had problems, but trust me: the Middle East always had.
_Gumper_: Interesting nickname for me. People have tried and failed to win in Afghanistan. We're the last hope.
Unless the UN DOES SOMETHING!
I thought we were the "United" Nations, not the "Divided" Nations.
Outlaw Star: AHHH! Canadian politics! Well, the reason you only see CANADIAN deaths is because you are watching CANADIAN news. When I watch HLN (American), on Nancy Grace they'll list AMERICAN causalities because they're in AMERICA. However I have seen CNN list other deaths in the wars that aren't American.
Also, tighten up the security of the U.S and all other nations. Because yesterday, I heard on the news that EXTREMELY important information surfaced the internet. ANYONE COULD SEE IT.
Well, that was Ghosty's rant for the day! Yay!
MODS, please post!
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I have an idea! We bring the Canadian Forces, the United States military, the armies of the Middle Eastern nations involved in this war, and other nations of NATO, and we unleash a full-fledged assault on the terrorists. Bomb them, shoot them, use the arsenal our countries are packing, the resources, and the intelligence to FINISH THIS WAR. Then, all coalition troops pull-out, and the Afghani's look at their country. If they need help in the future, foreign nations should have to help.
No sissy efforts. This is a war they WE ARE ALL involved in. When those terrorists attacked the United States, they just didn't attack America, they attacked all the countries who's citizens were killed/affected in 9/11. They also showed us that terrorisms exists, and that they will not back down easily.
Boxix: Well, I not sure if Afghanistan has always had problems, but trust me: the Middle East always had.
_Gumper_: Interesting nickname for me. People have tried and failed to win in Afghanistan. We're the last hope.
Unless the UN DOES SOMETHING!
I thought we were the "United" Nations, not the "Divided" Nations.
Outlaw Star: AHHH! Canadian politics! Well, the reason you only see CANADIAN deaths is because you are watching CANADIAN news. When I watch HLN (American), on Nancy Grace they'll list AMERICAN causalities because they're in AMERICA. However I have seen CNN list other deaths in the wars that aren't American.
Also, tighten up the security of the U.S and all other nations. Because yesterday, I heard on the news that EXTREMELY important information surfaced the internet. ANYONE COULD SEE IT.
Well, that was Ghosty's rant for the day! Yay!
MODS, please post!
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posted:
12/9/2009 9:42:18 PM
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ghost> then we are guilty of the same crime we are trying to avenge. >:| What makes us right by bombing the crap outta their country but they aren't allowed to do it to us. many eastern nations feel that they are right. They are fighting a cause they believe in. who are we to decide that we are the ones who are right.
i got into an interesting discussion about this is history last year. everyone couldn't get over how the east worked.
Does nobody understand WHY there are different countries in the world. it's because people have different beliefs. people believe in different religions, government systems, education standards, etc. who are we to tell them that they are wrong?
forcing your beliefs on another culture/country is what's wrong. it's called cultural imperialism, and it's the only reason this (and any other war for that matter) is happening.
Finally, i wouldn't hold my breath, the troops are not going to leave in 2011. they're too dug into this to just say, "sorry, laterz"
Roborat
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ghost> then we are guilty of the same crime we are trying to avenge. >:| What makes us right by bombing the crap outta their country but they aren't allowed to do it to us. many eastern nations feel that they are right. They are fighting a cause they believe in. who are we to decide that we are the ones who are right.
i got into an interesting discussion about this is history last year. everyone couldn't get over how the east worked.
Does nobody understand WHY there are different countries in the world. it's because people have different beliefs. people believe in different religions, government systems, education standards, etc. who are we to tell them that they are wrong?
forcing your beliefs on another culture/country is what's wrong. it's called cultural imperialism, and it's the only reason this (and any other war for that matter) is happening.
Finally, i wouldn't hold my breath, the troops are not going to leave in 2011. they're too dug into this to just say, "sorry, laterz"
Roborat
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posted:
12/10/2009 4:11:11 PM
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The UN is in fact mostly controlled by the USA...not formally but they would be nothing without the Americans...and the Americans have already made it clear their intentions, the UN can't step in or they are toast.
The Taliban aren't fighting a war to win or lose, they are just looking to make the most chaos at any means possible, there is no way to win against them.
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The UN is in fact mostly controlled by the USA...not formally but they would be nothing without the Americans...and the Americans have already made it clear their intentions, the UN can't step in or they are toast.
The Taliban aren't fighting a war to win or lose, they are just looking to make the most chaos at any means possible, there is no way to win against them.
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posted:
12/10/2009 5:13:48 PM
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Mayhem
rank: 1543
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Roborat: Yah...and your point is what? I'd rather prosecute/kill the terrorists for what they did than let them get of scott-free and kill other civilians.
I'm not saying bombing the entire country, just areas where terrorists are being harboured.
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Roborat: Yah...and your point is what? I'd rather prosecute/kill the terrorists for what they did than let them get of scott-free and kill other civilians.
I'm not saying bombing the entire country, just areas where terrorists are being harboured.
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